England in Zimbabwe?

[CJ D]

With the ICC and other factors turning up the heat on the ECB 1. Will England tour Zimbabwe later this year? 2. Should they Tour?

I think that they will tour (as to which players will pull out on moral grounds we shall have to wait and see), the huge financial threat makes this almost certain (certainly if the Counties in any way think it could harm their payout)

I also think that they should tour - The main weapon of human rights campaigners is publicity, (if nobody knows it is happening , who is going to stop it?), an England Tour will give them a months worth of front / back page headlines. Plus everybody else is going and what makes us so special that the rules shouldn't apply.

It would be nice though if the Government just put an end to it, by banning the ECB from sending a side, that way everybody is happy - I have not seen anybody say they would object to this course of action (maybe it would be different if the team or anybody in the country wanted to go, but they don't).

[Richard Jenkins]

I'll come back on this later CJd, but I can give lots of cricketing reasons why a tour should/shouldn't go ahead; I've got work now, and I'll come back a little later.
the UK government can't legally ban any tour, and safety, not human rights should be the ecb's biggest concern; If players decide not to tour, then that's there choice; I think a tour won't go ahead, not with a full stength English or Zimbabwian team anyway.

[Farmer Giles]

Morning RMJ. How are things in Anetz? I've yet to locate it on the map, but I'm sure it's better than Milton Keynes, which is not where I live by the way. Big problem on the farm at 6am this morning. One of the milking machines broke down and me and Brenda had to do 50 cows by hand. Tiring work, although Brenda is very adept at it. I shall get Mr Gooch, the local farrier and blacksmith, to fix it by tonight.

The Zimbabwe question is a real can of worms, as Mr Randall, the local fisherman who uses a coracle to fish on the beck at the edge of Bottom Pasture, would call it.

To go or not to go. If we go, there will be a big opportunity to keep the plight of those poor people in the headlines. The Zim cricketers will also have an opportunity to express their views about the dictator Mugabe.

If we don't go, that will be making a statement that we will not play sport in a country where people are being deliberately starved. As usual, the cricketers are between a rock and a hard place, as the politicians and cricket authorities dither on the other side of the boundary.

[Rachael]

I'm with you on this CJD: I have never liked sporting boycotts.. and am not sure there has ever been one that's justified. It's sentimental tokenism, the worst kind of meaningless gesture politics, papering over gross failures on the part of those whose job it is to deal with these matters.

It might be different if Zimbabwe were the subject of damn-near world-wide pressure, on the front pages day-in and day-out and on the brink of change... but it ain't: there's little evidence that Zimbabwe is that much worse a place to maintain ties with than 8-10 other places like Azerbaijan (haven't we got a big football match there sometime soon), Pakistan (where we're almost certain to tour before long) and Sri Lanka (just been).

Personally I'd like to see a 'B' team tour: make Hick captain... and select from politically motivated volunteers to fill the rest of the team. Richard is right - the publicity would be good.

[cantplaycantalk]

Rachael, Don't know about Azerbaijan, but Pakistan is at least fighting terrorism, not too sure about the current governments record on a few things, but they are making an effort. Sri-Lanka just had a democratic election (no worse than the last American one from what I can tell.) If you want real equivalents look at Burma, or perhaps Chechnya. I have made my opinions well known on this over the last year.
I am frankly appauled that our gutless government will not make any real stand against Mugabe. (Perhaps if Zimbabwe had any Oil or if they had threatened American interests)
Mugabe is probably at present the MOST evil dictator anywhere.
However even if you don't want to bring the countries government into this, the ZCB is banning anyone with an opinion they don't like. Should we be playing against a cricket board which is showing itself again and again to be A) Just a puppet of a corrupt regime. B) Racist to the point where any player not of the colour that they choose is regarded as worthless.

[Glamorgan Wanderer]

I was thinking about who would actually tour the other day. Would players actually want to tour if they knew they were nothing more than a second string outfit being sent to ensure the ECB complies with its contractual obligations? And what happens when some of them play well on the tour? Do they get picked for the games against SA or are they politely thanked for their efforts and sent back to the UK? Questions, questions...

[cantplaycantalk]

Well since India just cancelled a tour of Bangladesh on the grounds of an overfull schedule, I was wondering if we could arrange a quick series in Florida to boost USA cricket ahead of the next world cup, and cancel Zim for the same reason. Mr Bush must owe us one by now and his brother runs the state after all.

Plus with the number of players withdrawing from the Zim squad on the grounds that the board doesn't like thier politics the USA probably has a stronger side right now.

[Richard Jenkins]

Anetz has about 1500 bods in it including cats chickens sheep and cows!!
its near Nantes, in North western France

As you say the Zimbabwe question is a toughie, damed if you do, damed if you don't; i think the tour should go ahead, but contradicoraly, if I was in the squad I wouldn't tour. Make sense of that!!
Good things
supports cricket in zimbabwe
gives money to zimbabwian cricket
gives cricket supporters a festival
bad things
gets used as a platform by "dodgy governments"
violence could erupt
could give english cricket a reputation if we tour
could give english cricket a reputation if we don't tour

[Farmer Giles]

Exactly RMJ. It needs the cricket, and indeed the Government, to get their backsides off the fence and make a decision. It shouldn't be left to the cricketers. They didn't arrange the itinerary and they have to do what they are told. If some of them decide not to tour for moral reasons, will their careers be put in jeopardy? I personally don't think we should go.

[Richard Jenkins]

Yes the ICC need to make a judgement call. i think the UK government hve "mumbled" something about "we'd rather you didn't go old chap" to the team but i've read that they cant for legal reasons say you musnt go. Still this is what happened in South Africa; However, everybody (or almost every body) was in favour of a boycott against SA and so it happened; it tok 30 years to work,but it did work, and now anybody can represent SA; David sheperd and BasilD'olivera made their stands, and others followed, and the boycott worked; boycots only work if everyone is involved; look at the Moscow olymics in the 80's (afganistan)and Seol (can't remember why)olympics, both boycot victims, but Russia and America are still chugging away.
I've no idea about the situation in Zimbabwe, but i'll wager it not nice.