hi - i'm new here . . .

[Rich Greenfield]

not to mention all the pies he eats

[R W S]

Originally Posted by Richie Benauds Love Child

Frankly with all the football we play (although if he stays at everton we can be safe in the knowledge he'll not be playing in europe) and the injuries players get, i'd have thought those odds would be higher.

That's bookies for you! They gave me a quote over the phone at short notice so I didn't expect them to be generous.

[Electric Vic]

I cannot allow the assorted criticisms of Jonny Wilkinson to stand without throwing in my two cents...

Far from being one-dimensional, Wilkinson is also the best defensive fly half in the world. He's not bad in attack, either - I saw him score a blinder against the All Blacks at Twickenham. Michalak is the one who is overhyped - he's improving, but not in the same league as Wilko.

The important thing about Wilkinson is that he works hard on his game - practising his kicking endlessly, adding an attacking element to his game in recent seasons by working on his sprinting and his foot speed.

I can't think of any England cricketer with the same dedication to improving his game, sadly. At least the England set-up has improved in terms of the coaching on offer, though it's still nothing like as sophisticated as the rugby team's back up.

[James M]

Hey Mr Kiwi, my favourite cricket friend from the southern hemisphere . Welcome to this cricket forum. Sorry but got to go, there are some sorrows that need drowning. My cricket team have just lost. Anyway, heres to a good and competitive Test and ODI series which England wins easily...only joking...I think.

[debbotheiron]

May I suggest you drown your sorrows with some Guiness!!

[Mr Kiwi]

hi all - can't stay long i've got to get kitted out for graduation (finally) - good point about 'outlook' of cricket players, though i can't really explain why respective outlooks would differ. kiwi's do tend to be a humble lot (it comes from having noisy neighbours), and rating yourself tends to be frowned upon.

and in true tall-poppy style let me just say that jonny wilkinson is a great player - but michelak is better!

[Mr Kiwi]

oh yeah - hello james (and everybody else of course)

[Irish Left Armer]

I'm a big follower of football and while I reckon you are probably right about a lot of fans not looking in depth at games that in my opinion is just the difference between the two sports.

Owen is a good player but not in my opinion as good as he was a few years ago. From what I can see while some of his game is developing in some ways he is going backwards in others. Overall I don't think he is the player now that he was a few years ago. He is still an automatic selection for England but seems to be losing his way at Liverpool. Houllier and the football Liverpool play can probably be blamed for this also. I also think he will burn out relatively young. A lot of his game is based on his pace and he has been going full tilt since he was 17. He is injury prone and will be finished by the time his is 30 in my opinion.

Heskey is a donkey, pure and simple, he has no eye for goal whatsoever, only plays for England because he is at the same club as Owen.

As for Rooney, anyone who reckons he is not worth his place for England obviously doesn't know what they are talking about. His raw ability is better than anyone England have anywhere in the team. There's no doubt he's not the finished article and he is an aggressive little **** but he is definitely worth his place in the team.

As for whether he will get to 106 caps or whatever, I really doubt it. He is a nutcase and will get a serious injury the way he runs around the field. Looks to me like the same will happen to him as happened to Gazza. An incredible talent who can't keep his head together.

[Goatman]

Hi EV,

Glad to see you backing up Wilko, but I beg to differ on Michelak. The guy is magic - I'm with Mr. K on this one. You can tell how good he is by the fact that he makes good defensive teams hurry so much. When he started turning it one in the six nations, there was a faint feeling of scramble about the Engalnd defense and rank panic in the lesser defenses. They say you can spot a great player because so much time to use on the ball:- well I reckon you can also tell them by the lack of time opposition defenses have.

[Electric Vic]

Originally Posted by Goatman

Hi EV,

Glad to see you backing up Wilko, but I beg to differ on Michelak. The guy is magic - I'm with Mr. K on this one. You can tell how good he is by the fact that he makes good defensive teams hurry so much. When he started turning it one in the six nations, there was a faint feeling of scramble about the Engalnd defense and rank panic in the lesser defenses. They say you can spot a great player because so much time to use on the ball:- well I reckon you can also tell them by the lack of time opposition defenses have.

You and Mr K may be right - I just haven't been impressed with what I've seen (including the RWC semi, when Michalak fell apart) a few Toulouse games on the TV and some of this year's 6N. Michalak seems to me to offload the ball as fast as possible to the big guys in France's midfield - now, Jauzion, Brusque, etc - they really are good.

Sorry the Neths didn't do better in the C&G - Gloucester have had a wobbly start to the season and I thought we might struggle.