Vaughan to Step Up in the Middle Order

[high_on_linseed]

Having given this some thought over the past four days, coupled with whether to go to Crete or Santorini this year, has been the exact amke-up of the middle order.

I'd previously advocated Tres dropping down to 6, to leave Vaughan as a free-wheeling opening foil to Strausss' more circumspect approach. But now, life without Nasser has left me thinking, we really need an experienced head to anchor the middle-order at 10-2, or whatever Nas was saying. Colly at four? Possible, but too much responsibility at this stage. I also think its important that the right players get a chance to bat together. Butch and Thorpe, for example, look a lot more fluent and carefree when they're at the crease together. So there's a case for moving Thorpe to four and batting Vaughan at five. But four left-handers in the top order? Mmmmm...

A better idea, which is what is probably gonna happen, is to bat Vaughan at four, and let him decide the tempo of his innings, based on the match situation. I think he could do the Nasser "grind it out at all costs" job. That is what he was doing when he first entered the side. But now, I think he's in a better position to impose himself on the game, if he sees fit. It will mean yet more rests on Vaughan's shoulders but maye no more so than opening and captaining.

I also think in future, tres has gota be looking over his shoulder at the younger openers around like Key, Newman, and Jefferson, and possibly thinking about getting ballet lessons to get those feet moving. Tres doing "Swan Lake"? I'll leave you with that thought....

[Scott-Wozniak]

Originally Posted by high_on_linseed

A better idea, which is what is probably gonna happen, is to bat Vaughan at four, and let him decide the tempo of his innings, based on the match situation. I think he could do the Nasser "grind it out at all costs" job. That is what he was doing when he first entered the side. But now, I think he's in a better position to impose himself on the game, if he sees fit. It will mean yet more rests on Vaughan's shoulders but maye no more so than opening and captaining.

I also think in future, tres has gota be looking over his shoulder at the younger openers around like Key, Newman, and Jefferson, and possibly thinking about getting ballet lessons to get those feet moving. Tres doing "Swan Lake"? I'll leave you with that thought....

HOL

Yeppers, thats pretty much what I think is going to happen, for the reasons you've said - you've seen the light!

Scott

[Occasional Fan]

No contest: Santorini every time.

[Whips_off_the_bails]

I stil think Tres should be the one to move down the order. He hasn't the technique to open the batting at the highest level, as Strauss certainly does. Opening with Vaughan and Strauss would also give us the RH/LH combination that bowlers find so frustrating; though of course if Vaughan is first out, we'll have two southpaws right away again. I think with these two at the top of the order, we may see some decent first wicket partnerships on a more regular basis.

This may seem harsh on Tresco, as he had a decent match at Lords. And he did bat very well with Strauss in the first innings, nursing him through the nervous nineties in a very responsible way. I would love to see Tres given a well-deserved match off if we win at Headingley. That way we could try out this line up at Trent Bridge:

1. Strauss
2. Vaughan
3. Butcher
4. Thorpe
5. Collingwood
6. Flintoff
7. G Jones
8. Giles
9. Hoggard
10. S Jones
11. Harmison

Giles keeps his place because he showed at Lords he can be an effective bowler if treated as a proper bowler, not just brought on in the 78th over to up the over rate. G Jones will hopefully by then have erased the memories of his Lords disaster behind the stumps. Thorpe is up to four because he should be at least as high as that.

However, if Trescothick has a good match at Headingley and Butcher fails again, the latter could be the one who gets "rested".

I just have the feeling that Collingwood could be our "crisis specialist" in the middle order in the way that The Saviour of English Cricket was for so many years.

[Rachael]

IF Collingwood DOES play at Headingley... and we DO win... then the case for giving him the rest of the summer to show what he's made of would be pretty reasonable: the WI shouldn't prove particularly stubborn opposition, it would be a home series in high summer and he'd not really have any grounds for protest if he made a hash of it.

That would leave us knowing where we stood on him ahead of the winter... when he might settle into that permanent 1st reserve spot that is so important on a long tour... or give way to (say) Pietersen (who will presumably tour, even if he doesn't actually play int he Tests).

[Ernest]

Originally Posted by Whips_off_the_bails

I stil think Tres should be the one to move down the order. He hasn't the technique to open the batting at the highest level, as Strauss certainly does. Opening with Vaughan and Strauss would also give us the RH/LH combination that bowlers find so frustrating; though of course if Vaughan is first out, we'll have two southpaws right away again. I think with these two at the top of the order, we may see some decent first wicket partnerships on a more regular basis.

1. Strauss
2. Vaughan
3. Butcher
4. Thorpe
5. Collingwood
6. Flintoff
7. G Jones
8. Giles
9. Hoggard
10. S Jones
11. Harmison

Giles keeps his place because he showed at Lords he can be an effective bowler if treated as a proper bowler, not just brought on in the 78th over to up the over rate. G Jones will hopefully by then have erased the memories of his Lords disaster behind the stumps. Thorpe is up to four because he should be at least as high as that.

WOTB
My only dissagement is I would have put vaughan at no 3,and opened with Butcher,who has not looked happy at no 3,I am not sure abour Collingwood we will have to see.
Glad to see you have kept a spinner,an all seam attack does not seem to work.

[flanflinger]

Looks more and more likely that Vaughan will bat at No4, which although I am not 100% happy with that, probably makes sense. However, if Trescothick doesn't produce then we have Vaughanie to step back up to the top.

It is funny though that England now have four opening batsmen!!

[Ernest]

Originally Posted by flanflinger

Looks more and more likely that Vaughan will bat at No4, which although I am not 100% happy with that, probably makes sense. However, if Trescothick doesn't produce then we have Vaughanie to step back up to the top.

It is funny though that England now have four opening batsmen!!

flannfinger

Could be he bats at no 3,if Collingwood does not play,risky going in without aa slow bowler,we have been in this possition before,Strauss looks at home opening,Butcher has not looked at home at no3 Tresothick is an opener.

Tresco should I think open with Strauss or Butcher,with vaughan at no 3 or 4,there are advantages everway,two left handers.the bowlers would get used to,and then the next man in would be a right hander.

I think vaughan skould go down the list,we nees some stability now that Hussain has gone,and he has not looked that good opening as he used to be

[Rachael]

It's always been said that a Test batsman should be an opener for his county and a test bowler should be a new-ball merchant for his county. Consider: Strauss, Key, Butcher, Vaughan, Thorpe, Tresco as a top 6... that would be 5 of the top 6 bats matching the classic profile. Excellent.

I believe the general thinking is that it's better to take a guy who'se temperament and technique can stand up to the tests of facing the new ball and add on some scoring shots than it is to take guys like Thorpe and Hussain, who entered the Test arena able to score all over the park when the balls are their to be hit, and help them cope (mentally, technically) when the going gets tough.

Strikes me that the crucial thing is that whoever plays, and wherever they play, they can all cope with the new ball.. partly because even the best openers get out 1st ball, and 2 wickets down inside 30 minutes is, statistically, not uncommon... and partly because the key to a decent first-innings total always seems to boil down to seeing off that second new ball.

Every once in a while you seem to get someone so god that they can come in as a middle order specialist: Viv Richards, David Gower, Graham Thorpe, Brian Lara... but it strikes me that they are the rarities - you have to be bloody good to survive that way. Maybe Pietersen will add his name to the list... but when you look at all the folk who tried and failed as middle-order specialists... I think there's a good reason why names like Key, Bell, Wagh and the U-19 guy (is it Cook?) keep cropping up!

[Rachael]

Ernest: where do you get the idea that Butcher looks unhappy at three?

Since his recall into the Test arena Butcher has made that spot in a way that no Englishman has since David Gower. He's been contributing more than anyone in the side except Vaughan and Thorpe (the obvious class acts).. and in the past 12 months he's been contributing more even than them. He's looked the complete player.. reassuring in time of need... devastating when the occasion has arisen. Arguably our lynchpin.

No-one else currently combines the beligerence to survive when called in early with the strokeplay to capitalise when coming in later and (critically) the tremendous innings-building capacity to consistently turn starts into high scores. He's the model no 3.

I was never a fan of Butcher: thought he got in as Stewart's brother in law and through the Surrey links.. but last winter he was the only guy to play Murali with real authority, averaging 50+ against him.. he was superb in the WI, grinding out the nasty moments with Nasser and delighting crowds with sublime strokeplay when the opportunity arose... and many would back him to be the leading man this spring and summer as well.

Of all the players in the side... he's the one I would most defintely NOT move!