Best Spinner, I can't bat::keedy.>

[Ernest]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/cric...re/4297687.stm .

If whst Keedy says is true, it shows just how inept the England selectors are, Keedy reckons he is second only in the last two years to:

Originally Posted by Keedy

I was second only to a world-class leg-spinner [Pakistani Mushtaq Ahmed

.

Well if this is true, does every bowler in the England team have to bat?, are wickets not as imortant as runs?.

If he is second only to "Pakistani Mushtaq Ahmed", can England afford to keep him out?.

He has not even got a place in the A Team.

[Chuck Palumbo]

I don't think there is much difference between him and Giles as bowlers, but Giles is twice a better batsman than him so thats why he is not in the team at the moment. Even when we do decide to play two spinners- possibly in the sub continent next winter, he will struggle to find a place in the team because its not ideal to have 2 left arm spinners in the same team, an off spinner or even better a leg spinner would be far preferable.

Although if Giles is ever injured, he provides a good back up but I fear his time may have gone as an England bowler because he is around the same age as Giles so he is a bit unlucky that his time as coincided with Giles.

[Mike]

It's a disgrace that Keedy hasn't got a call-up while in the best form of his life. That's why players do the hard work. His stats over the past two years are twice as good as guys getting call-ups to the national or A team. Keedy has a right to be miffed. Gives me more resolve to get the WAT tournament happening.

[Chuck Palumbo]

Originally Posted by Mike

It's a disgrace that Keedy hasn't got a call-up while in the best form of his life. That's why players do the hard work. His stats over the past two years are twice as good as guys getting call-ups to the national or A team. Keedy has a right to be miffed. Gives me more resolve to get the WAT tournament happening.

Why is it a disgrace? Giles was our best bowler during the English summer so you can't seriously say we should select him over Giles...also, I think you will find that Batty has just as good as record with the ball as Keedy in the last 2 years in county cricket not to mention Batty is a much better batsman and fielder than Keedy....his time has gone.

[Mike]

Chuck, the 2004 County FC figures show Keedy's average was 5 less than Batty's. Batty gets a call up to SA - fair enough. But why doesn't Keedy go on the A tour ahead of Dawson and Swann? He's left out of the picture completely! Is Anderson's batting much better? Yet, he gets games. It does seem unfair. The reason the selectors can afford to play Anderson is because Giles makes runs in the lower order. If Keedy was in for Giles no way would Anderson get a game. I won't disagree that Keedy has limited his opportunities by his batting weakness but he deserves a run with the A team to show what he can do at that class level. By the way, how do you rate Murali's batting average of 12.56 bolstered by 42 not outs?

[Chuck Palumbo]

Fair points...I just don't think that Keedy is that good of bowler to merit a place regardless of his poor batting and fielding...something which Swann and Dawson provide. They also have age on their side unlike Keedy and its probably more of looking to the future rather than them being better bowlers than him...because when Giles's time is up, Keedy is likely to be on his last legs as well so they are probably just considering their options.

[Ernest]

Yes Chuck, but come on, keedy would have been a good like for like if Giles was not available, you mentioned Dawson, well we have seen what he can do.
Problem with the selectors they have no faith in the top order batting, so everyon after 5 has to be able to bat, Englands present batting starts with Flintoff at 6.
Spinners seem to learn to bat, unlike pacemen.
John Enbury was a good example of this, as is Giles.
Underwood learned to hold an end up.

Spin bowlers should be picked on their ability to bowl, not as an all rounder.
Same with Jones, he is keeping a better keeper out, fair enough, but because of batting, do we keep our best bowlers out as well?.
Keedy never even made the a team!!

[Chuck Palumbo]

But the question is, is Keedy such a good bowler to merit a place in the team regardless of his batting? I'm not too sure...if it was Mcgrath or Murali, then fair enough but I don't feel Keedy is ever going to win you games with the ball and therefore it is probably better to play a spinner who can contribute with the bat.Some may say its negative but I don't feel playing Keedy gains you more than playing someone like Swann or Dawson who can make good contributions with the bat(with Swann possible 100s) and also field decently...something which Keedy is not great at.

Also you have to think about the balance of the side...its not wise to pick him alongside Giles as two left arm spinners in the same team makes the attack to similar and as a replacement for Giles, he would leave the tail looking too long...and we all know that Fletcher likes to have batters all the way down to 8 or 9.

[Ernest]

Yes he is a decent spinner, no one has his better recent stats in England.

England will never be a great team while they are settling for second best everything because of how a player can bat.

We have a second rate keeper in G O Jones how many runs does his mistake cancel out what he scores I wonder?.

Same with bowlers, for every wicket a bowler would take, "than what a bowler chosen instead instead for his all round skills, how many runs does that wicket equal.

I cant see what is wrong with having two slow left arm, because most of them are different.
Underwood was just short of mp, at times, Giles bowles in the main over the wicket.

keedy is a more attacking bowler, not afraid to bowl arround the wicket, now that is variety.

I would at least give him a go in the A team, and if Giles was injured, I would leap frog him over the likes of Batty.

[Pete]

Originally Posted by Mike

By the way, how do you rate Murali's batting average of 12.56 bolstered by 42 not outs?

In recent times he hasn't been the worst tailend slogger you'll see

But seriously, it's not really the greatest comparison. Keedy will never amount to the bowler that Murali is.