This is plainly NOT fair!!!!

[flanflinger]

Originally Posted by Richie Benauds Love Child

I notice the head chap from lancs has thrown the toys out - slightly cheeky considering he's probably played about 10 games for them in the last 4 years. More headlines !

It would be interesting to see how they got the quote. Knowing the press, someone would have called up Jim Cumbes and asked "have you read the Guardian story today where Vaughan blames Fred for the World Cup Failure", his response "No", their response "do you have any comment to make"... and he will then go off on one..

It is a well known Journalist tactic, funnily enough, when he the reads the full article, they are not so keen to interview him??

[Wanderer]

Uhmmm...where did my post dissappear to?

And now I cant' recall what poignant points I was going to make

Originally Posted by RBLC

Surprising. I notice the head chap from lancs has thrown the toys out

I think perhaps we are still going to see a lot of toys being thrown out a lot of cots...before the wind dies down on this one. Maybe we will even hear stronger words than "despicable" (now that is, IF Jim Cumbes is not mis-quoted )

[Ernest]

Originally Posted by flanflinger

I was just thinking Ern had been a bit quiet!!

Think you too have been suckered into believing the headlines and not the actual quotes..

No - I don't think so FF, I have read what he said on Cricinfo click here , I have also read the link you posted.

Originally Posted by Michael Vaughan

. "That incident changed the whole atmosphere in the camp," he said. "We went into the New Zealand game with a really good attitude but we didn't play well and after 'Fredalo' we just started taking it all too seriously. That might sound silly but everyone was too tense and desperate. There was no escape - and even on the field you have to be pretty free, especially in one-day cricket."

Look at the quote marks, he said what he said - and that fact can't be escaped.

(If) Flintoff made Vaughan "more tense" - what does Vaughan think this blab will do to Flintoff?, how can Flintoff ever take orders from Vaughan again with a good heart?.

Vaughan lost the World Cup - Flintoff took the flak for the Ashes, because he was captain - Vaughan did no better in the World Cup, in fact he did worse because he contributed nothing at all.

Flintoff was stripped of the "Vice Captaincy", he was "fined", he was given a "public rebuke" - and was banned for one game.

Thar was ENOUGH - if Vaughan was a half decent person (never mind captain) - he would not have brought up the pedalo incident at all.

He should be looking ahead, and moving on - not raking old **** to be thrown, one thing is certain - Flintoff will never again be able to give his best with Vaughan as captain, I think this was the idea of Vaughan's rant.

[darksideofthemoon]

This was dealt with in March. Flintoff was suspended for one game, had the captaincy removed, was fined, apologised and that was the end of the matter. Why on earth mention it again? Vaughan could have brushed over the question and said that the team didn't play well, there were no excuses and everyone has accepted responsibility.

[Rachael]

Vaughan's done exactly the right thing here: he's been honest and truthful enough to be credible, he's closed ranks with team-mates and accepted his own part in the under-performance in order to protect the individuals who underperformed and he's been careful to avoid saying anything that might upset a team-mate - maserful stuff, given the potential for cocking up.

I've got reservations about Vaughan's captaincy... as he clearly puts pressure on players to "not die wondering" in ways that lead some to being too adventurous for their own good... but when he handles the media brilliantly he should be praised rather than castigated!

[darksideofthemoon]

You might be happy with Vaughan but Moores is not.

http://sport.independent.co.uk/crick...cle2617366.ece

[Occasional Fan]

Took me a while to get to it, but I've read the interview in The Guardian and I can see nothing wrong with Vaughan's comments. Later today I'll read the reports about him being "slammed" over his comments (that word appearing on the BBC's headline). My initial view, however, is that, if he is really being "slammed", the slammer should read the interview again.

[greg]

Talk about making a mountain out of a molehill.

There are a few points that need raising...

1 What the hell are the journalists doing asking Vaughan about it anyway on the eve of the match?

2 Why have the press printed that Vaughan blames Freddie as from what i have read he just says it was a contributary factor not the sole reason?

3 Why is the Lancashire chairman being such a pompous idiot?

4 Why would Flintoff be in the England dressing room now anyway,he is injured and all injured players should be kept away,like Vaughan should have been in Australia?

Oh well,i guess this is going to rumble on for a while and will no doubt be dredged up again when/if Flintoff and Vaughan are selected in the same England side in future.

[Andy Mellon]

Personally, I think Vaughan has shown an incredible amount of naiveity in this article. Sure, he hasn't actually said anything that directly slates Flintoff, but it doesn't take that much reading between the lines for his words to be interpreted in that way.

Frankly, given that he is supposedly a master of sound bites, empty platitudes and speaking volumes without saying anything (could be a New Labour politician could Mr. Vaughan) it is faintly ridiculous to believe that he didn't realise that his words would be interpreted in the way they have. Call this naiveity, stupidity or deliberate, none of these are traits that we should be seeing in the England captain.

[flanflinger]

Originally Posted by Ernest

(If) Flintoff made Vaughan "more tense" - what does Vaughan think this blab will do to Flintoff?, how can Flintoff ever take orders from Vaughan again with a good heart?

Sorry Ern, but he never mentions Flintoff, he talks about how the incident effected the morale of the England camp. Not once does Vaughan blame Flintoff, but if you read the article properly, he blames himself. Take the "Flintoff" tinted glasses off, forget about the headline and read it for what it actually says.