It's not all Matt Prior's fault - is it?.

[Ernest]

Now before I start this thread I am one who believes that Read should be Englands first choice keeper.

However on the radio, on the tv - and even on this forum I have heard and read just how poor Prior is.

Lets see what Prior has to say click here.

Originally Posted by Matt Prior

This week has been the hardest week in my cricketing life, without a shadow of a doubt[...]
My performance has been criticised but I am still learning. Mistakes do happen - we're all human.

"Still learning" he says - well Ian Bell got a very good run after two ashes disasters, and Strauss is lucky to be in the squad.
LINK:click here.

Has Prior really done that worse than some other England so called stars against India?.

Strauss averaged 35.16 - with a top score of 96 out of his 211 runs, so he went 5 innings averaging only 23.

Collingwood scored 197 runs, with an average of 32-83.

Bell managed only 190 runs, with an average of just 31-66.

Collingwood as a bowler got 4 wickets @27-25, very credible.

Panesar took only 8 wickets at 50-37, but he is allowed an ordinary series.

LINK: Averages

My point is that even though Prior spilled 3 catches, is not as good a keeper as Read - the batting was what really let England down, and caused a 1-0 series defeat.

If prior has to go, then other should follow.

Anyone agree that Prior was no worse than most other members of the England team?.

[Rachael]

Originally Posted by Ernest

Anyone agree that Prior was no worse than most other members of the England team?.

First things first: sticky sweets and lousy glovework aside... the England team played a full part in an extremely good series... and it was very much a team effort (with all contributing). Few of the players deserve criticism for their performances... which mostly ranged from the first rate (Vaughan, Pietersen, Sidebottom) through to the merely encouraging (Bell, Tremlett).

Sure... Cook's got a technical flaw to sort... and Strauss has to get back to playing his own game rather than trying to be Marcus Trescothick II... and Panesar's got to learn to take some pace off... but none of these are major problems.

Prior's glovework, however, looks unfixable: he's actually worse at wicket-keeping than Ganguly and Tendulkar are at bowling... and than Kumble is at batting. I'd go further: if both worked non stop on wicket-keeping throughout the winter tours... I reckon Collingwood would emerge as better behind the stumps than England's chosen stopper.

As Boycott put it: when the bowlers start hoping that the chances go to second slip rather than to the 'keeper.. you've had it.

[Ernest]

Originally Posted by Rachael

the England team played a full part in an extremely good series... and it was very much a team effort (with all contributing). Few of the players deserve criticism for their performances...

I agree we watched more proper cricket in this series than in the last 3 years, but I think we saw some brilliant application from the Indian batsmen, not really so from most of the England batsmen.

The depleted England bowling on the other hand (without extreme pace) served England well, so yes we did see some good cricket - but the remains a question mark over both Bell and Strauss, and to a lesser degree Cook.

Originally Posted by Rachael

Prior's glovework, however, looks unfixable: he's actually worse at wicket-keeping than Ganguly and Tendulkar are at bowling..

Well he has had some good innings, amongst the bad innings - I agree that he has to go, but it would be unfair to drop Prior, yet take Strauss on tour.

Boycott also said along with most of the TMS team, that Strauss should be given a rest this winter - and let him come back to regain his place refreshed next spring, they and that included Boycott did not enthuse over Bell's consistency either.

The cricket has been good to watch - but Kumble IMO showed more application batting the the whole England batting line up (Pietersen apart).

I doubt Prior will tour this winter, but if Read can't get a game - then who is there that we know can deliver?.

[darksideofthemoon]

Prior is a Moores favourite and he won't be going anywhere but maybe we should be blaming Moores, his keeping coach, from a young age. Prior's footwork is worse than his glovework. All the criticism from the keeping starts affecting his batting and if things don't change quickly he will have scrambled brains like Jones had in the end. With Flower as coach he should improve.

I just wish it was Read who was our keeper, as he is great to watch.

[Moss]

Anyone prepared to bet that Prior gets a central contract?

[Collyisamackem]

Phil Mustard is the same type of batsman - even more devastating in fact - and probably now a better and more consistent one than Prior, and in a completely different league with the gloves. Did anyone see him standing up to Ottis Gibson et al in the FPT and Pro40 games so far this season? If not him then Read, Foster, Davies or even Ambrose (not sure if this is ex-Sussex bias from Moores but I haven't seen Ambrose play) would be perfectly acceptable. Geraint Jones was far more impressive and even the anti-Jones among us would acknowledge that!

Prior is a shocking keeper but a talented batsman. If he could hold the majority of his catches and average 40 I'd be happy, but I don't see him doing the latter and certainly nothing like the former!

[Notts Exile]

Originally Posted by Collyisamackem

Phil Mustard is the same type of batsman - even more devastating in fact - and probably now a better and more consistent one than Prior

Is he? His Championship batting average this season isn't at all impressive and he hasn't score a ton.

Guess which English qualified keeper has the highest average in the Championship across both divisions? (Sangakarra averages more but hasn't kept)

I'd love to see us pick a proper gloveman but I just don't see it happening, especially not while we have Sidebottom or Tremlett batting at eight!

[Collyisamackem]

Originally Posted by Notts Exile

Is he? His Championship batting average this season isn't at all impressive and he hasn't score a ton.

Guess which English qualified keeper has the highest average in the Championship across both divisions?

I'd love to see us pick a proper gloveman but I just don't see it happening...

Although Mustard hasn't made a ton this season he has made far more regular, important and reliable contributions to the side at 6 or 7 and only follows Di Venuto, Coetzer, Chanderpaul, Gibson and Collingwood as regular first teamers in the averages. His two first class tons came last season in Durham's first season in CC1 for quite some time, marking the improvement in his batting. Against Warwickshire he opened with Michael Di Venuto and helped to chase down 170-odd in about 25 overs making 76 - his top score this year. His FPT average is far more impressive (42 with one hundred, 72 fours and 8 sixes) which may lean towards him playing more in the ODI side at present, but his CC batting has definitely improved in its consistency and reliability. Remember that Marcus Trescothick has a first class average in the thirties, Collingwood averages 29 in the CC this season and Read, as you point out, averages very highly this season, so averages aren't everything to selectors!!!

[Notts Exile]

Originally Posted by Collyisamackem

Read, as you point out, averages very highly this season, so averages aren't everything to selectors!!!

Be careful! This is hardly a one off for Read, he's averaged loads of the past four seasons (in fact, ever since Fletcher dropped him in the Caribbean!)

[Mike]

I've always maintained that a player's future should be based on their 2nd home season. Bell had a great 2nd home season against Pakistan in 2006 (Bell played two innings against Bangladesh in 2005 but I don't count that series because they weren't serious opposition) and doesn't warrant dropping yet despite underachieving in this series against India. Cook has had two good home seasons in 2006 and 2007 and is definitely a player of the future. Tremlett has impressed in his first home season but needs to back it up in 2008 to become a regular.

The players who most disappointed me in the series against India were Strauss, Bell and Panesar. I think the others performed acceptably given their level of experience. It was a long summer for Sidebottom and he bowled spiritedly throughout. He should continue to get opportunities in the future. Prior is probably good enough with the bat to continue the experiment of playing a batsman-keeper. He must shine next summer, though, with both bat and gloves, otherwise even I will admit enough is enough. I'm just not sure whether good footwork and anticipation can be learned or is instinctive. I know Prior is mentally strong enough to work hard to improve. England can't afford to give him more than one more home season, though. Don't be surprised if other keepers serve notice next year because there are some good up-and-coming keepers around. I'm sure this will be a hotly debated issue when the WAT 2007 team is selected.

It's not news that most series wins are setup by good opening partnerships. As a senior member, Strauss needed to contribute more runs. In my opinion, he is playing for his spot in the team now. If he has another ordinary series against Sri Lanka England will almost certainly lose that series. That will almost certainly see him dropped.

This series was the 7th of three or more matches for Bell. At this stage in his career he is expected to score heavily in the middle order. I think he's another one that is on shaky ground as far as Test selection is concerned. Panesar, simply should have taken more wickets in the 2nd half of the English summer when pitches are drier. The good batsmen have worked him out and he's too predictable. He should have been a match-winner in this series but he was tamed by the Indian batsmen. I think he's future Test selection is more certain than Strauss or Bell but he was below par in this series and should accept part responsibilty for the loss of the series.

If I had to list the players in terms of certainty for future Test selection from most certain to least certain the order would be as follows:

Pieterson, Vaughan, Panesar, Cook, Collingwood, Sidebottom, Tremlett, Bell, Anderson, Prior, Strauss.