Yes, but how can we see whether or not Flintoff has actually "moved on."

We could not say with any certainty, unless he manages to go a couple of seasons without transgressing.

He has been stripped of the vice-captaincy, he should not even be thought of, for the top job, till summer 2009 at the very earliest.

To actually say now: "well since the press conference Freddie certainly has turned over a new leaf - we know that because he said so... let's give him the captaincy" would be utter, crass, nonsense.

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Red-it, Red-it, Read it and wept

The only side Freddie will captain is Lancshire.
Botham never captained England twice and he was a better player than Freddie. He has had his shot at the top job and the sooner he and the fans move on the better.

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"Checkout the big brain on Brett" Pulp Fiction

Big difference - Botham was forced to resign after a run of bad results, and bad form - Flintoff has been demoted for misconduct.

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Ern

I always wondered how Freddie managed to look so unhealthy given all the activity he does... Now I know.

If all goes well then he should bouce back, get off the booze and start acting like a proffessional athlete. Then hopefully England can have their best player back in a leadership role.

Ponting was a bit of a boozer back in the day too.

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It's hard enough to remember my opinions, without remembering my reasons for them!
Nietzsche

Yes and more - but Cricket Australia had the good sense to stand by him, and he has repaid them by winning everything there is to win.
Probably including this World Cup.

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Ern

CA wacked him over the head with a 2x4... Dropped him if I remember correctly. It's not the inital punishment that is important, its how both Freddie and the entire English establishment handle the situation from now on. In other words they should all get off his back and let him play cricket.

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It's hard enough to remember my opinions, without remembering my reasons for them!
Nietzsche

I wonder if this would have been as big a story if we had beat NZ and Fred got a 100 and 5 wickets? The press love to climb in to a scapegoat when we're losing. He was just stupid doing it in public as I've posted elsewhere.

Its what he does on the field that counts.

Bit harsh on the results Ern? Botham lost 1-0, 2-0 to arguably the greatest test side ever. No argument on the form however.

I thought it was harsh at the time, however they both got the elbow for different reasons, Botham was never going to get the captaincy back - Flintoff would have got of with a fine if England had beat New Zealand IMO, also I think the 5-0 defeat was in the back of the selectors minds.
As though any other captain could have made a difference with Trescothick and Harmison not fit to be there, and a squad full of newbies as cover.

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Ern

http://www.bbc.co.uk/mediaselector/c...bram=1&nbram=1


Some key areas:-

1. Flintoff admits he let people down
2. he admits that he needs to grow up
3. he admits that he has done this in the past
4. he says the punishment is correct
5. he says he needs to grow up