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  #71 (permalink)  
Old 19-12-2004, 12:27 PM in reply to Zainub's post starting "Can't be forgotten OF, that we batted..."
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zainub Razvi
Can't be forgotten OF, that we batted just about as poorly as we could have.
To be honest I think we have every capability of batting just as badly again. Only a 60 run partnership between the two fast bowlers prevented a similar scoreline last time. I remember saying earlier that i was quite relieved as the score could easily have been 79 rather than 179.
  #72 (permalink)  
Old 19-12-2004, 12:35 PM in reply to Shaka's post starting "To be honest I think we have every..."
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We seem to have two threads going on the batting: my thoughts are at http://www.world-a-team.com/showthre...9132#post29132

It starts "I don't think ANYONE should get on the back of the batsmen for their second innings performance" and ends "When the coach puts his faith in a bowler-led side (5 man attack).. and they land the batsmen in a near-enough impossible situation... start the blame with the bowlers."

Sums it up for me: this 2nd innings is as unrepresentative of Pakistan's batting potential as have been the 40-something that England once made (quite memorably) against the WI.. or as the lousy WI total from this spring when Harmison bagged his daft return.
  #73 (permalink)  
Old 19-12-2004, 08:45 PM in reply to Rachael's post starting "We seem to have two threads going on..."
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hehehe .

Grandad Glenn took 8/24... Hehehehehe
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  #74 (permalink)  
Old 19-12-2004, 08:57 PM in reply to Beny's post starting "hehehe:) :D . Grandad Glenn took..."
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Did you notice, Beny, the report I placed here: http://www.world-a-team.com/showthread.php?t=1865

Several contributers have suggested that the hostility and aggression of Akhtar makes him a great bowler.. but even a sympathetic judge would struggle to rate him in the same league as Donald in terms of hostility and aggressiion... yet Atherton said he'd rather face Donald than Pollock because Donald gives you more balls to score off.. and that he's rather face Pollock than McGrath.. for the same reason.

Batsmen don't particularly relish hostility and aggression.. but they really, really dread quality :-)
  #75 (permalink)  
Old 19-12-2004, 09:04 PM in reply to Rachael's post starting "Did you notice, Beny, the report I..."
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Well it's in the stats... Who has a better record? McGrath and Pollock by far but McGrath beats Pollock too.
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  #76 (permalink)  
Old 19-12-2004, 09:12 PM in reply to Beny's post starting "Well it's in the stats... Who has a..."
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I don't think anybody in their right mind has ever claimed Shoaib to be on a par with either McGrath or Pollock though. He clearly isn't. A lot of Pakistani fans are always comparing him unfavourably with Wasim and Waqar too...erroneously IMO. He should be judged for what he is, and that's a decent fast bowler whose opinion of his own abilities is perhaps just a wee bit over-inflated. Still a good bowler though, however frustrating at times.

Last edited by Shaka : 19-12-2004 at 09:14 PM.
  #77 (permalink)  
Old 19-12-2004, 09:40 PM in reply to Shaka's post starting "I don't think anybody in their right..."
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Exactly my sentiments.
  #78 (permalink)  
Old 19-12-2004, 10:30 PM in reply to Zainub's post starting "Exactly my sentiments."
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I don't think Pakistani supporters should get too down about their team because of this result. The commentators remarked that the Pakistani batsmen played too much with an open blade which makes it easy to get nicks on a fast, bouncy wicket. They will learn some batting lessons from this match. The other batting problem Pakistan need to overcome is to occasionally take on the bowlers. Currently, they are batting according to Australia's plan instead of batting to their own plan. They shouldn't allow opposition bowlers to dictate so much. It is risky but playing defensively against Australia doesn't work. Pakistan need to try and put some pressure on the Aust bowlers and fielders.

Incidently, McGrath's figures were the 2nd best ever in Aust's Test history. He also has the 4th best figures as well.
  #79 (permalink)  
Old 20-12-2004, 06:48 AM in reply to Mike's post starting "I don't think Pakistani supporters..."
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike
The other batting problem Pakistan need to overcome is to occasionally take on the bowlers. Currently, they are batting according to Australia's plan instead of batting to their own plan. They shouldn't allow opposition bowlers to dictate so much. It is risky but playing defensively against Australia doesn't ork. Pakistan need to try and put some pressure on the Aust bowlers and fielders.
You make a valid point Mike, but it isn't easy, is it, but when you're facing McGrath, Gillespie, Casper and Warne. You really don't have as many scoring opportunities. I guess the right approach would be to try and rotate the stike as much as possible, when you don't have enough balls to score boundaries off, your best chance is to take those quick singles, convert the twos into thress and so on...that can put a bowler off at times, Waqar Younus said a lot of times how he'd rather be taken for a four and have the same batsmen on strike next ball than be nudged or pushed away for a single...but then we have another problem...our running isn't the best in the world...I don't reckon there is as such a problem in the speed in which we run, the likes of Younis Khan and Abdur Razzaq are very quick in between the wickets, but judgement of runs is very poor, and top of that there seems to be no clear cut method of calling.

But in principal you are right, attack is the best form of defence, the trick here is to chose the right balls to try and score of, we need to improve on shot selection, that was a major concern for me in both our innings in Perth.

ps: Bob Woolmer, Pakistan's coach, admitted that his side's performance at Perth was so poor that he is contemplating calling in a sports psychologist in a bid to revive the team's spirits. Full report here: Woomer battles Pakistan's 'mental confusion'

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Woolmer
"It's more really, I think, that we have to look inside here," Woolmer said, pointing to his head. "I'll speak to a couple of friends and things like that, I have some ideas. There are one or two very helpful people who will help me."They can't come from outside," he stressed. "They are the ones that understand their own people and that's very important. "It was an abject performance, very disappointing," Woolmer continued. "I can't speak for them, but obviously there's an element of the mental confusion and the mental awe in this performance. "There's a combination of the technical side and the mental side involved in the way they played that particular innings. We will go back to the drawing board and work hard.We've been working very hard on leaving the ball and playing straight, and as soon as they got into the middle that went out the window. We're going to have to keep talking about it. We need the guys to get in, spend 30 minutes at the crease and then start playing square of the wicket, but it's not happening. We can't make excuses."
You might also be interested in reading this: "Our performance was pretty abject, in fact many of you predicted as such and I will not make any excuses."

Last edited by Zainub : 20-12-2004 at 08:07 AM. Reason: Adding Woolmer quote/s
  #80 (permalink)  
Old 20-12-2004, 10:06 AM in reply to Zainub's post starting "You make a valid point Mike, but it..."
Rachael Rachael is offline
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"For days we had practiced not playing square of the wicket and leaving the ball. We had talked endlessly about playing in the “V” and building our innings."

Oh.. for "days" eh? Nothing quite like having few days to learn how to play Test cricket!

If learning to leave well was easy then everyone would do it well.. and Glen McGrath would hardly ever get wickets. Even Thorpe (fantastic square of the wicket, now as patient as any player in the England setup) took a few years to learn to leave well. More to the point... when under huge pressure even experienced players get out that way.

I'm all in favour of batsmen forcing the bowlers to bowl at the stumps by leaving anything wide / short.... but {a} that goes against everything these players learn in ODI cricket; and {b} it tends to be the preserve of the "method" players.. like Bailey, Boycott, Gooch, Steve Waugh, Hussain, Kirsten and Richardson.. who all took years to master it.
 


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