mmmmm

[acker]

Fleming captain

mmmmmmmmmmmmm

Vettori captain

has merit

[Seamer]

I agree. Some members of this forum believe he is the best captain in the world. I think he has lost it. His tactics are one-dimensional and deviod of his previous innovation. His body language tells it all. Sulking at first slip with his arms crossed and frowning is hardly the way to inspire the team to greater efforts.

[Zainub]

Hmmm ....What's Fleming done wrong suddenly, I thought the phrase that he was "the best captain in world cricket" was coined by New Zealanders them selves

[Zainub]

Originally Posted by Seamer

I agree. Some members of this forum believe he is the best captain in the world. I think he has lost it. His tactics are one-dimensional and deviod of his previous innovation. His body language tells it all. Sulking at first slip with his arms crossed and frowning is hardly the way to inspire the team to greater efforts.

Well, that's a bit harsh, me thinks. With the kind of attack at his services (O' Brian, Martin, Franklin, Vettori and part time medium pacers of Astle) I wonder how differently he could have done things and if that would make any difference ...give him a better attack and then see what happens I don't want to go into the debate of if he's the best skipper or not but in the past when NZ have had the services of better (and inform bowlers) (an attack of Bond Tuffey Oram and Vettori for instance) he's done a good job ...not his fault that his bowler don't know how to ball six ball at one spot, or is it? And if someone's that inconsistent, setting fields for them can hardly be easy.

[Seamer]

Among other Zainub. I was a fan of his captaincy, but i can tell you that now, he is looking very very tired

[Seamer]

Originally Posted by Zainub Razvi

Well, that's a bit harsh, me thinks. With the kind of attack at his services (O' Brian, Martin, Franklin, Vettori and part time medium pacers of Astle) I wonder how differently he could have done things and if that would make any difference ...give him a better attack and then see what happens.

The Kiwis were ranked 2nd in the world in one dayers before the Aussies beat them 5-0 so his attack could,nt be that bad, and in fact, the current bowlers are not that bad. I can feel for him in the tests, every team cops a flogging from the Aussies in test matches, but he has no excuses for the ODI,s

[Zainub]

I don't blame him for loooking tired, when he's got a team like that, you are bound to look tired. I'm not convinced the alternatives will do a better or worse job, Vettori has captained NZ before, in the one-day in B'desh, I didn't see those games, how did he do? But then, those games can hardly be considered a good enough judge of how good one really is

[acker]

I think his physichal looks and demeanor suggest that he should be the best captain in the world, but tactically and under pressure Youhanna,Vaughan,Ganguly,Ponting,Smith/Pollock and Ponting/Gilchrist all line up well ahead of him.

He always seems to be looking for excuses or setting small targets of acheivement.

[Mr Kiwi]

as far as i recall the 'best captain in world cricket' was coined by ritchie benaud after the series in Eng in '99, followed up by the tour of Aus in 00/01. while many a kiwi will keep harping on about it till their blue in the face, that was a long time ago and now i think things have changed

so far as i can tell fleming has lost whatever it was he had since last summer when he was (i believe) out-captained by graeme smith. since then he has regressed to sulky slip standing

some comments above aobut his captaincy becoming boring and one dimensional and i'm inclined to agree. there was a time when watching him manage the field and bowlers was entertaining and i (as an armchair cricketer) would actually learn stuff about how to captain a cricket team. nowadays he just seems to put hte fielders there and mope while his boring and one dimensional bowling attack (vettori aside) continually gets it wrong. shouldn't a good - or dare i say it, 'the best captain in world cricket' - be able to manufacture something from any bowling attack?

it's impossible to tell what goes on in the dressing room, where presumably the man-management side of fleming hte captain is still working well and holding things together, but i get the impression that something is no longer clicking since the new coach took over

the other problem is that vettori is not (in my opinion) ready to be a test captain at the moment. he has very little captaincy experience at domestic level - in fact he's played relatively few domestic games whatsoever

[vvvrulz]

I agree, Vettori isn't quite up to taking the reigns just yet. We can't just sack Fleming after so many years of good work, although it does seem obvious he is lacking ideas at the moment. Personally i'm a bit disappointed at the selections, leaving out the likes of Ian Butler and Paul Wiseman, giving Fleming very little to play with and end up bowling Vettori non-stop.