Never is a big word Ern, Broad is loose limbed and very tall (and still growing), and only 20!! I think that to say he will never do that is a bit premature.

For me he has the height that can discomfort batsmen without the need for being that fast.

Now if you said that we should give him a year, I would be more inclined to support your position. But for me Broad, along with the likes of Cook, Bell, Anderson, Panesar and KP should be the key players for England over the next ten years.

I don't think Dalrymple a second spinner as you put it can get in the same side as Rashid, I suppose given time Yardy will be able to turn his arm over if needed, by the way yardy can turn the ball given conditions like Warne.

As for you comparison with Broad against Mahmood it does not IMO hold water, Broad has only payed in one day cricket, Mahmood on the other hand has bowled winning spells for England.

I doubt at Test level (and this is what A Team is about) broad "could" hold his own against Mahmood.

I remember commentators in the pajama gave giving Mahmood stick for the 20+ tuns he conceded in the penultimate over, but never mentioned the fact that Lewis conceded the same in the last over, that's the trouble with one day cricket, bowlers who have to bowl at the death, will never stand comparison in terms of averages and econ rates.

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Ern

What I am saying is for now ff, maybe never was a bit strong, however I don't think at this moment he has the potential penetration that Mahmood does, like Andy Caddick and even James Anderson mahmood can produce match winning spells out of the blue.

Yes I do take your point about never - he needs a touch more pace to be considered at Test level, he may develop this in the next year or so, I would be pleased if he did.
I suppose I am looking for as near as I can get, Harmison and Flinoff(the bowler).

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Ern

Agreed. That said... I'd not be surprised if Tom Smith joined that list: he's just taken 35 wickets at 30, which is pretty impresive for a 20 year old in his first full season, but what sets him apart is the way he's done it - his 383 overs went for a McGrath-like 1073 (econ 2.8).

Youngsters who spray the ball around and get occasional wickets are common enough... but youngsters the captain can turn to with confidence are a true rarity... and he can both bat and field in the slips as well!!!

Note the comparison with his senior club colleagues:I share your confidence in Broad... and the pair of them, along with Anderson and Tremlett, should prove great consolation when we start getting yet more dreaadful reports of Mahmood and Plunkett this winter!!!

Which is why Smith is also in my XI, and why I am very very excited about the next five years!! Harmison, Flintoff, Hoggard, Jones and Giles who bowled us to the Ashes last year have some excellent replacments on the horizon in Broad, Anderson, Panesar, Smith, Mahmood and Plunkett. The future is very bright IMO.

Who else would you suggest to bat there? There are no others who can bat in that position and bowl as well as he can. Just because he bowls off spin doesnt mean he shouldnt play. All of the spinners spin the ball, and in very spin friendly conditions they would, I'd imagine, turn it a long way. Theres more to bowling spin than just turning it, Kumble hardly does and if he was available I'd pick him. When we can pick 2 good spinners of that quality it is worth picking them both.

All I compared was the games they played together, in addition i did point out that in first class cricket as well, Broad has been more effective than Mahmood, whatever forms they have both played, Broad has done better. How does this not hold water?

Mahmood has bowled 2 small spells of note this year. I dont doubt that Broad could at least equal that now, and in the future I think it far more likely that Broad will be ahead of Mahmood in the pecking order.

Hold on, this was about test/first class cricket. How many overs of death bowling do you bowl in a first class season? Certainly not going to be enough to damage your figures irreparably. Apart from that Broad opens (when the field is up) and bowls at the death for Leicester as well, which Mahmood seldom does even for Lancs.

Why does a batsman have to be able to bowl?, and why is Dairymple the only candidate for that spot?
If you are right and this is the case, then better we play Prior and choose another specialist bowler - would be the same, but extra fire power.


Mahmood has not to my knowledge been available as much as Broad, in any case players with better stats in county cricket don't mean that they make better Test players, if that was the case - Hick and Ramp's would have been playing.
The only times Mahmood and broad played together was in one day cricket.
If you are right - then why is Mahmood likely to start against Australia, and not Broad?.

You are just guessing about the future - Mahmood has had his two match winning spells, Broad has not in Test cricket.

I was making a point that Mahmood always gets stick, when so called better players Lewis in this case got carted for just as many - England v Pakistan ODI this year..
Broad may well have a future, but IMO is not ready yet, and IMO also England don't do well with two spinners.

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Ern

Important announcement: Tom Smith should have been included in the shortlist.

Ernest somehow overlooked Tom Smith in voting for the shortlist despite wanting to include him in his final XI. I have ammended the poll, but that means Tom Smith should have been included as a shortlisted player. I have ammended the list and if that has implications for your side please PM me!

Thank's Rachael - sorry guys if I have messed anything up.

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Ern

OK folks...we're heading towards a problem: consider the following side.... comprising those players with at least two-thirds support from current responses:

1. Compton
2. Newman
3. Joyce
4. Yardy
5. Dalrymple
6. <wicket-keeper>
7. Rashid
8. Broad
9. Mahmood
10. Smith
11. Tremlett

The problem is that we all want at least one extra batsman and one fewer seamer.... but we can't agree on which batsman to include (Shah, Sales and Clarke are near-enough level-pegging) or which seamer to drop (Smith and Mahmood are level-pegging but just one vote behind Tremlett)!!!

ps. Narrow majority for Foster as wicket-keeper at present....